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01.Jul.2013



PC OpenSystems LLC kündigt "Amiga OpenLinux" sowie AmigaOS-Unterstützung an
Roberto J. Dohnert von PC OpenSystems LLC, der vor einer guten Woche die Umbenennung seiner Linux-Distribution in "Amiga OpenLinux" angekündigt hatte, hatte sich bereit erklärt, sich in der Nacht von Sonntag auf Montag einem moderierten IRC-Chat mit Amiga-Usern zu stellen.

In dem rund zweistündigen Gespräch (kompletter Mitschnitt s.u.) erklärt er, dass er die Markenzeichen "Amiga OpenLinux", "Amiga Enterprise Linux" and "Amiga Education System" beim US-amerikanischen Marken- und Patentamt habe registrieren lassen. Dies sei möglich gewesen, da Amiga Inc. bereits seit vielen Jahren keine Betriebssystem-ähnlichen Produkte mehr unter diesem Namen vertreibe und schon seit langem kein Warenzeichen für Software mehr registriert habe (Anm. d. Verfassers: Amigas registriertes Warenzeichen gilt lediglich für Computer-Hardware).

Einige Stunden vor Beginn des Chats hatte Dohnert auf amigaworld.net eine Auflistung der Dinge veröffentlicht, die er und sein Team zum eigentlichen AmigaOS beitragen wollen: Darunter Portierungen von Qt, Gtk, Java und Chromium, oder eine Virtualisierungslösung um Linux-Anwendungen unter AmigaOS laufen zu lassen. Auch im Chat bekräftigt er diese Pläne nochmals, Nachfragen zum erwarteten Aufwand werden jedoch nur sehr ausweichend beantwortet. Seine Motivation zur Mitarbeit sei lediglich der Wunsch zu helfen.

Praktisch zeitgleich mit dem Chat wurde auch ein neuer Blog-Eintrag auf os4online.com veröffentlicht, in dem erneut ein neues Logo für Dohnerts Linux-Distribution angekündigt wird: Das Wahrzeichen soll nun doch ein weiß-/roter BoingBall werden - aber einer, der nach links statt nach rechts geneigt ist und (Zitat Dohnert) "sich nur dreht, und nicht hüpft".

Der komplette Mittschnitt:
(01.07.2013, 00:00 Uhr, #Team*AMIGA auf irc.superhosts.net)

<Kelli217> Ladies and gentlemen, Roberto J. Dohnert.
* Ken gibt Voice-Status an rjdohnert
<rjdohnert> Hey guys how are you doing. My name is Roberto, I am the CEO of PC OpenSystems LLC out of North Carolina and the lead developer of the OS4 OpenLinux project soon to be the Amiga OpenLinux Project
<rjdohnert> We look forward to answering all your questions
<rjdohnert> So lets go ahead and get started
<Ken> eliyahu How did you secure a license to the Amiga trademark? And from whom?
<rjdohnert> We secured the US trademark through registration with the USPTO of Amiga OpenLinux, Amiga Enterprise Linux and Amiga Education System
<Ken> eliyahu So that means you have no license from the IP owners, correct?
<rjdohnert> Yes, we are the IP owners of Amiga OpenLinux, Amiga Enterprise Linux and Amiga Education System
<Ken> broadblues what is the purpose of you chanig your brand name to include "amiga"
<Ken> pjsX1K How many people (full time, part time, outside) in your organization and please give some history of it (dates, accomplishments, etc)?
<Ken> pause to let him catch up
<rjdohnert> Amiga has always meant to me cutting edge, it also means user friendliness and the ability to use the computer to do your tasks quickly and efficiently. Now the Amiga OS in all of its days has done just that and we want to bring that to the Linux world. We feel and our users feel we are the most user friendly, cutting edge distribution of linux on the market today
<rjdohnert> So we share a lot in terms with what Commodore did all those years ago
<Ken> rjdohnert: ask for next question so we know you're ready
<rjdohnert> We have about 5 full time employees, we also have numerous contributors that help out. Our passion has always been to bring the best technology to the masses, we did that with PC/OS , OS4 and we intend to keep doing that with Amiga OpenLinux and Amiga Enterprise Linux
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <eliyahu> OK. So, again, you did not secure a license for the marks from Amiga, Inc.? <Kelli217> I would expand on eliyahu's question ... That is, you either contend that Amiga, Inc.'s trademarks are abandoned or you are purposefully posing the issue in order to force such an opinion?
<rjdohnert> Once again, we didnt need to get an IP license from Amiga Inc. We are our own brand. Since Amiga Inc no longer owns, resells or develops computer systems or general computer operating systems we feel they have indeed abandoned the market. The current buisness of Amiga Inc is in the game market and mobile market and we do not intend to get into that market.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Ken> broadblues do you assert that the amiga linux and amiga (traditional shall we say) tardmarks do not conflct?
<rjdohnert> No they do not and if you do a USPTO look up, Amiga Inc owns the trademark regarding computer hardware, they lost the trademark for computer operating systems and software development tools
<rjdohnert> Those trademarks have been dead for quite a number of years now
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Ken> pjsX1K What specific experience (things done?) do any of your staff have in coding & completing AmigaOS apps?
<rjdohnert> Our CTO, Cristobal was an Amiga developer, Seth and Daniel, who are on our team also are Amiga enthusiasts and worked in the traditional Amiga market. Plus with the 5 of us we have a lot of years in computer development
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Ken> PaulS what makes the amiga linux different from other linux distributions, is it just looks
<rjdohnert> No, its a stable product. If you look at traditional Linux distros you are a constant beta tester. They push new kernels, new drivers and beta and sometimes alpha quality software on their users. We dont do that. We use a stable version of the kernel, our apps are the production ready stable releases and we test our distro alot before we release. So users know they are getting a stable, ready product and we wont push out
<rjdohnert> a new kernel and take the chance of crashing their systems or interrupting their infrastructure.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Ken> liyahu How large is your current community? Do you think having the Amiga brand will help add to those numbers significantly?
<Ken> [15:18:32] eliyahu You posted a long list of to-dos on AWN recently. How was this list determined? Are you already working with existing AOS developers? Do you have a
<Ken> cooperation agreement with A-EON?
<Kelli217> Take your time answering all of those, Roberto.
>rjdohnert< CTCP VERSION
-rjdohnert- VERSION xchat 2.8.8 Ubuntu
<rjdohnert> Our current community with customers and just users who use the free distribution is about 12,000 altogether. We are hoping that the brand shows the Amiga community that we are there to help them, they can continue their hobby with Amiga OS on the powerPC and use our distro for more modern needs, running servers, being able to access modern tools and technology that the Linux community has to offer. The list was determined by
<rjdohnert> the team and we looked at the current situation of the Amiga and asked how can we contribute? These solutions were reasonable, it helps the community. A-EON is assisting us with our port of OS4 PowerLinux, that product will be for the PowerPC processor, Why did we name the product OS4 PowerLinux. Because we felt in the PowerPC market where Hyperion and the Amiga OS were present, that we didnot want to confuse users or cust
<rjdohnert> omers on whether they were getting Amiga OS traditional or what they were getting. So since our position is not to interrupt Hyperions market we decided to keep the name OS4 for the PowerPC distro. We are hoping to extend cooperation with other PowerPC developers as well
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <JimS> Could you explain what your product means to say classic users under UAE, OS4 users on PPC hardware, and AROS users on x86?
<rjdohnert> AROS users, will benefit because they have a wider usage scenario, using Hosted AROS will allow them to keep running their classic apps and give them a modern platform for them to be able to accomplish tasks they may want to do that the classic Amiga cant do, It also helps get AROS out there into a broader audience who may want to join the hobby and elp extend and expand that. Since Amiga OS 4 does not have a server component
<rjdohnert> to it, OS4 PowerLinux works in two ways users can continue to use Linux in conjunction with Amiga OS 4, we do intend to make it as user friendly as our x86 distro, and also when the time comes and they buy a new machine for the Amiga OS, they can recycle their current investment and set up a simple file server at home or use it as their Linux desktop
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Ken> pjsX1K Please tell us when Cristobal was an Amiga OS dev and what applications he worked on.
<rjdohnert> Cristobal is not here with me, he has posted his e-mail address and you can ask him that when he gets a chance
<rjdohnert> next question
<Kelli217> <broadblues> How does you "stable" PC/OS OS4 Amiga Linux compare with a standrad distros stable release?
<rjdohnert> Even when a tradition, stable distro gets released it still has a lot of beta and sometimes Alpha quality software and they claim its stable. With our distro, if you download it and look we do not mix in software from beta channels. So you are getting the latest stable release of ALL your applications.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Ken> ktadd You mentioned assisting with writing device drivers for AmigaOS4. What types of devices do you plan to support?
<rjdohnert> Wifi devices, hopefully through AROS get touch screen working properly, and also common networking devices. If the time comes and AROS, Amiga OS, and even MorphOS has a problem with getting certain devices to work we will offer our expertise and development resources to helping them get it to work properly.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> There is not qurrently a question pending, but at least one person has said that they are composing one
<rjdohnert> ok
<Ken> <broadblues> so you are saying PC/OS OS4 Amiga Linux is a very out of date distro then?
<rjdohnert> No, as a matter of fact its a very up to date distro. If you look at our product when an application achieves stable release status we compile and include it in our repositories and thats why if you download our distro, certain software versions are ahead of what Ubuntu or Linux mint includes
<rjdohnert> Nect Question
<Ken> Derfs you have talked about java and Qt for amiga os, have you spoken to the people working on the amiga os ports of them already?
<rjdohnert> Yes I have, and that conversation is ongoing. We are not here to throw bones to the community, we are fully commited that when say a new release of QT is available to immediately start work on the new release, same with Java and same with our port of Network Manager. We see how sometimes these releases that were produced before get 5 or 6 releases behind. With us working on Java and QT that wont happen.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <alanwall> since the ppc is considered end of life,how are you able to keep a distro up to date/are you able to port x86 apps to ppc ? Thanks !
<rjdohnert> The PowerPC is not EOL. There are several chip companies out there, IBM and Freescale who produce and continue to produce chips and systems with those chips. We need to open up dialogue and refresh the supply.
<rjdohnert> What apps we can port from x86 we will work on. Obviously things like Flash and other closed source software we cant.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> eliyahu had a very similar question to that last one, so we'll skip that.
<Kelli217> Ah, here we go. <Derfs> you spoke of partners selling amiga branded hardware, were you talking about a-eon or another company?
<rjdohnert> A-EON and other companies, both. Some of those companies are under NDA. We have a few announcements coming within the next 48 hours and some of these have been in the community before.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <ktadd> Chromium for AmigaOS4 would be great to have. How much time would you guestimate porting something like that would take? How could the community help
<Kelli217> bump it up on your priority list?
>Kelli217< you claim you're planning to work on AmigaOS drivers and software. why would you do that, i.e. where's the benefit for you, your group or your actual product?
<rjdohnert> Well its not a easy port, we are guestimating something like that would coincide with our release of our first betta of OS4 PowerLinux. Also, testers if we have committed testers we can produce a stable product.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K> Assuming you are not yet in possession of a current AmigaOS machine, have you ordered one or otherwise made arrangements to get one?
<rjdohnert> Yes we have.
<rjdohnert> Next question
<Kelli217> <mikebrantley> I'd like to know if any of the Amiga Open Linux team members will attend AmiWest.
<rjdohnert> I am planning to attend and we will be showing our work on OS4 PowerLinux
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <cgutjahr2> you claim you're planning to work on AmigaOS drivers and software. why would you do that, i.e. where's the benefit for you, your group or your actual product?
<rjdohnert> because we believe in community and we believe in helping alleviate problems. Since we are planning to be involved in the PPC market as well it will help benefit the users as they will be able to use the same hardware for OS4 PowerLinux without having to swap out devices because it doesnt work with the Amiga OS. So this helps users, and its the right thing to do as a citizen of a community.
<rjdohnert> Think of it like this, if you live in a village where you have an electronic water pump and your neighbors dont, are you going to just let them use yours or are you going to help them build one for themselves.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K> how long will it take to port GTK or a linux VM to Amiga OS ?
<rjdohnert> We plan to release that in conjuction with our final release of OS4 PowerLinux so far its feasible, doable
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <vapor> To do AmigaOS drivers will you need to have at least Developer status with Hyperion?
<rjdohnert> That depends on Hyperion. If Ben Hermans wants to open up discussions with us and let us join as a part of a developer network, we are more than happy to do that and we believe cooperation is productive. If he doesnt then we will work with other Amiga OS developers and help them. What Ben does is up to him but we encourage you, the community, to contact him personally and urge him to do the right thing.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> PaulS How much RAM will the distribution need to run properly or does it require recent x86 hardware and will it have features we like so much in AmigaOS like a
<Kelli217> RAM disk that is available right after you booted.
<rjdohnert> 512 mb of RAM is the sweet spot for our distro on x86, we use a the XFCE window manager and its very fast and lightweight and except for the screen fan feature, which I would love to have, its very comparable to what is available in the Amiga OS in terms of ease of use.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <Derfs> are you looking at having an amigaos cross compiler pre-setup in the os4 linux distro, and if so when do you see this happening?
<rjdohnert> We are planning for the cross compiler to be ready for the 14.0 release coming in August. For 13.6, Hosted AROS will have all development tools installed.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <ktadd> What is the best way to contact you if we are intrested in beta testing AmigaOS4 software?
<rjdohnert> Contact the support team, support@pc-opensystems.com
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <PaulS> will there be any software compatibilty with 680x0 or PPC amiga software or will it include an Amiga emulator and a suite of Amiga software
<rjdohnert> UAE will be included but users will have to provide their own kickstart ROM. I intend to contact the right people to see if we can get a license to ROMS to include
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <ktadd> Have you tried contacting Hyperion yet? If so what was the response?
<rjdohnert> Yes, I have tried contacting Hyperion, despit a lot of run around, nothing has been achieved but Im stubborn and will continue e-mailing ben Hermans everyday as I have been doing.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <cgutjahr2> according to your blog, you have changed the OpenLinux logo *again*, now it's a red and white boingball again. this one *is* still used in commerce, are you trying to see if hyperion can muster a defense?
<rjdohnert> Its not a boing ball, its a checkered sphere which is different in the rotation of a boing ball. Ours will spin in the new Plymouth theme and not bounce As for the traditional Boing Ball, I could use it, the trademark for that has expired as well
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <cgutjahr2> btw. the beos guys have a broken water pump aswell. do you need a contact adress ? I could supply one
<Kelli217> That may be just a throwaway question. ;)
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K> While borrowing the history of the Amiga name might help your linux clone get some attention, how does dilluting the Amiga name help the profile and
<Kelli217> reputation of the real Amiga OS ?
<rjdohnert> Actually the BeOS community is no more, owned by ACCESS. Im sure Jean Louis could use one, do YOU need his contact info? Be glad to give it to you.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K> While borrowing the history of the Amiga name might help your linux clone get some attention, how does dilluting the Amiga name help the profile and
<Kelli217> reputation of the real Amiga OS ?
<rjdohnert> We are not diluting it and its a completely different beast. We are in the consumer and enterprise software market. The Amiga OS is in the tech hobbyist and PowerPC market.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <vapor> Is there possibility to get Eclipse and Xmos XC working for ppc (at least Eclipse)?
<rjdohnert> Excellent question, once we assist with the Java stack we actually discussed this morning Eclipse and we will evaluate that.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> There isn't one pending at the moment.
<Kelli217> Anyone? Bueller?
<Kelli217> Here we go, just a moment...
<Kelli217> <Derfs> what do you see as your biggest challenge in this journey?
<rjdohnert> The biggest challenge, Amiga Inc and Hyperion. I dont think from a legal standpoint as some have suggested. Getting them to be productive and assisting giving us straight answers. The code part while challenging is just time sensitive. Another challenge will be community support. Tho I think when we show them we are not here to play heart strings, we are here to be productive members I think that will help.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> Okay folks, it's been about 90 minutes now, so let's wrap this up. Last questions, please.
<Kelli217> This may be a repeat... <ktadd> What is the current timeline on your OS4 PowerLinux release?
<rjdohnert> Beta 1 by November 2013, full final release January 2014. We will be releasing the Beta to the public and testers. So when that lands please be kind. :)
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K which GUI would you use for the AmigaOS network manager? Intuition, Reaction, MUI, Triton, ReneGUI ?
<rjdohnert> MUI
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <ktadd> Could you explain what "Virtualization of Linux" on AmgiaOS4 would look like? Would it be something like AmiCygnix?
<rjdohnert> We are hoping more like X11 on certain other platforms, seamless and integrated well. We will also work on themeing so it doesnt look ugly.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <vapor> Do any of your team have PPC equipment of their own? If yes, what kind?
<rjdohnert> Mac Mini, g4 powerbooks, G5 and we are getting one from a partner in the very near future.
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> <pjsX1K> what sort of coding have you personally done?
<rjdohnert> I have done inhouse coding at jobs I have worked at, I have also contributed code to the OpenBSD group, the Linux community and currently I worked with the Raleigh Police department and helped them write their new checkin system at the new Justice Center and also attended the opining of that center. We are also working with a medical supply company where I am helping them port their own inhouse software to our Enterprise Linux
<rjdohnert> offering
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> I had another question on virtualization but it seems to have been answered
<Kelli217> Okay, another pointed question: <cgutjahr2> "OpenLinux" was a distribution from (IIRC) Caldera, you're old distribution logo was the old NeXT logo, the new distribution logo is a not-boingball and the current name of your distribution is borrowed from us. do you see a pattern here?
<Kelli217> Questions are now closed. We'll clear the queue before we call it done, though.
<rjdohnert> Are you reffering to the name OpenLinux from Caldera, Amlogic or many of the other Linux distributions that used the term OpenLinux? A cube is a cube, is a cube. Dont see how thats relevant to your case there and we are not "borrowing" anything. Completely different brand, completely different approaches
<rjdohnert> OpenLinux is a term used by many in the community because Linux is OPEN
<rjdohnert> Thanks guys, it has been great.
<Kelli217> Well, folks, I had only three question left, but it looks like Roberto is growing fatigued...
<Ken> thanks rjdohnert
<JimS> Thanks, Roberto
<rjdohnert> Well throw them at me if we have only three left
<Kelli217> Okay.
<Kelli217> vapor> Time flies. Do you or any of your team, like tinkering with hardware? Thanks Roberto.
<rjdohnert> Yes, we all love tinkering with hardware
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> Clarification: <broadblues> my question was a follow up as he said virtualisation would be via X server but we have X server (AmiCygnix)
<Kelli217> so perhaps how would it improve on AmiCygnix?
<rjdohnert> It will look very much more integrated and work like a regular application should. We are striving for once you click on a Linux binary, it will launch seamlessly
<rjdohnert> Next Question
<Kelli217> And the last one...
<Kelli217> <PaulS> Why should people upgrading from Amiga hardware migrate to your product over other products from apple or microsoft. If this product was geared towards existing Amiga users or mainly to new users not familiar with Amigas.
<rjdohnert> Both, it will allow them to use UAE or AROS to run the applications they know and love and we target an audience very much outside the "Amiga scene" so users who want to migrate away from Amiga and just have that one app they love can still use it.
<rjdohnert> As well as reap the benefits of Linux
<rjdohnert> Thanks guys
<Kelli217> Thank you, Roberto.
(cg)

[Meldung: 01. Jul. 2013, 02:15] [Kommentare: 40 - 04. Jul. 2013, 09:44]
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